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Post by whitesince63 on Mar 10, 2024 11:44:23 GMT
Good morning from Rotterdam are we going to regret not getting an out and striker in the window or are we just struggling to get the ball in the box. Hands on heart are we going to get automatic or will we have to settle for playoffs again COYWM Derby didn’t get a striker in the window either chip but they signed Gayle as an out of contract. No worries there about him not being 100% fit and he’s scored in the last two games. There’s nothing to stop Evatt doing the same given our striking problems but would FV trust him to know a “striker” when he’s already wasted money on Victor and Collins? Would you?
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Post by riochforthereebok on Mar 10, 2024 12:52:04 GMT
Good morning from Rotterdam are we going to regret not getting an out and striker in the window or are we just struggling to get the ball in the box. Hands on heart are we going to get automatic or will we have to settle for playoffs again COYWM Derby didn’t get a striker in the window either chip but they signed Gayle as an out of contract. No worries there about him not being 100% fit and he’s scored in the last two games. There’s nothing to stop Evatt doing the same given our striking problems but would FV trust him to know a “striker” when he’s already wasted money on Victor and Collins? Would you? A very very strong word there W63, ‘wasted’ On Vic I’d definitely say yes, on Collins, I’m actually also leaning towards the yes. He’s had enough chances to light up his Wanderers career but apart from THAT pass on his debut and that goal last week, his contribution has been very low key and my personal opinion of him yesterday, apart from hitting the crossbar, he might as well have not been on the pitch as his contribution was poor, when we needed him most I actually think we are just one more bad result away from conceding automatic promotion and I think it’s coming against Oxford I don’t ask for forgiveness for being so down right miserable about our chances, but come on, how many negative reactions have we done since our system of football was sussed out by the majority of managers in this league? We’re an open book with no manifesto, guessing our way to promotion with no second plan. Against Oxford, who will score for us?? Collins?? JDB ?? Jerome?? Penalty ?? Direct free kick?? Hardly!! From a corner ?? I wouldn’t bank on it And will our football style yield us a goal before the first half hour Doubt very much This is all Evatt’s doing
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Post by whitesince63 on Mar 10, 2024 19:33:41 GMT
You see I still don’t accept it’s the system that’s a fault rioch. In every one of our last half dozen games we’ve actually been by far the better team, created numerous chances and really pressured teams. You can’t blame the system, or Evatt for that matter, when it’s the players that are missing sitter after sitter whilst conceding comic book goals. Despite the last few results we’re still 3rd in the table. I know it’s at a cost because we’ve thrown away our games in hand but to be fair nobody else is doing a lot better so it’s not all lost yet. The system is also not responsible for losing so many players. The injury to Dion was a major blow in itself but the further loss of CMG just as he looked to be finding form and Victor who was finally starting to find a partner in AC leaves us threadbare. Add in the Baxter injury and again it’s not the system that’s to blame. As for Collins I don’t consider him an out and out striker, more a utility forward who plays alongside the strikers and I think he could have made a really good partnership with Victor. We’ve had the devils luck I’m afraid as well as some really poor defending and countless misses but little of this is really down to either IE or his system. If everybody does their job we win most games but the problem currently is that they’re not so put the blame where it really lies and that’s full square on the players.
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Post by riochforthereebok on Mar 10, 2024 19:53:07 GMT
You see I still don’t accept it’s the system that’s a fault rioch. In every one of our last half dozen games we’ve actually been by far the better team, created numerous chances and really pressured teams. You can’t blame the system, or Evatt for that matter, when it’s the players that are missing sitter after sitter whilst conceding comic book goals. Despite the last few results we’re still 3rd in the table. I know it’s at a cost because we’ve thrown away our games in hand but to be fair nobody else is doing a lot better so it’s not all lost yet. The system is also not responsible for losing so many players. The injury to Dion was a major blow in itself but the further loss of CMG just as he looked to be finding form and Victor who was finally starting to find a partner in AC leaves us threadbare. Add in the Baxter injury and again it’s not the system that’s to blame. As for Collins I don’t consider him an out and out striker, more a utility forward who plays alongside the strikers and I think he could have made a really good partnership with Aaron. We’ve had the devils luck I’m afraid as well as some really poor defending and countless misses but little of this is really down to either IE or his system. If everybody does their job we win most games but the problem currently is that they’re not so put the blame where it really lies and that’s full square on the players. I want some of your poison W63😃 I get all that and yes, I agree, we’ve been bloody unlucky with injuries to key players, but the system fails when it’s pass pass pass possession possession possession Rico with his foot on the ball, JDC having too many off days, Coleman gifting more howlers than he saves, Evatt using multiple subs, week after week, game after game. Terrible terrible terrible corners, free kicks, never playing the dark arts for penalties, never conning the refs like others do Some of that can be achieved by the players, but in general, the aforementioned needs to be improved on the training ground I have noticed in the last few games, some players dared to be brave enough to actually shoot on the odd occasion and for me, that’s what’s been lacking. Somebody take the game by the scruff of the neck and be brave enough to take on a man and shoot or just shoot when with a sight on goal I’m hearing that Dion has a further delay to his return!! When is our luck going to improve… If we fail on Tuesday, I could even see us dropping out of the play off frame with all these injuries as none of the fit players we have are inspiring
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Post by whitesince63 on Mar 10, 2024 22:05:05 GMT
I’m not going to deny any of the points you make rioch, in fact I agree with most of them but again I’d only reiterate that I don’t think it’s the system that’s wrong in itself but the way it’s applied. When we play it quickly we absolutely kill teams but I agree when it’s slowly, slowly sideways with Rico standing on the ball it drives me nuts but I can’t believe that Evatt directs the players to be that slow. Yes, keep the ball until gaps occur but when it gets too slow gaps won’t appear and that’s where we get stuck because nobody seems to have either the confidence or just plain nouse to do anything about it because it’s been drilled into them so much by Evatt. Either way this system has got us to where we are so it must have been working to a point but recently less well. I’m still behind Evatt and the system but I must admit to becoming less convinced recently that the players we have can carry it out. Our injuries to key players has hit us badly and I’m not sure the replacements are as capable of seeing us home. It doesn’t look good for Dion and probably Victor as well and with CMG and Dan still out longer term I think we’re stuck with what we’ve got. I agree on the set pieces, we’re absolutely woeful and totally lacking a threat and that’s been that way all through Evatt’s reign because we’ve never had a striker that can attack a ball or use physical strength because that’s just not Evatts way. If we fail this week then as you say we could even fall out of the play offs but to be honest I really don’t see that happening at all. We’re still in it and if we can profit from this week we’ll still be on track. I think we’ll do well so call me over optimistic if you like. 😁
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Post by kenglowhite on Mar 10, 2024 22:40:33 GMT
When Nat Lofthouse was injured, Bill Ridding put Malcolm Barrass at centre forward and he scored a hat-trick. I think Forrester could do that. Why not give it a try ?
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Post by whitesince63 on Mar 11, 2024 8:24:30 GMT
When Nat Lofthouse was injured, Bill Ridding put Malcolm Barrass at centre forward and he scored a hat-trick. I think Forrester could do that. Why not give it a try ? That’s a very interesting point Kenglo and I was trying to think who we could utilise up front to add a bit something different but I hadn’t thought of Forrester doing it. Either way I don’t see Evatt changing much because he doesn’t go for the high cross method which is why he doesn’t sign players who can do that. I suppose it would mean a complete change but sometimes if situations demand a change good managers make them, as you illustrated with Bill Ridding. Sadly Evatt isn’t BR and I don’t think anything will make him change his system so it looks like thinking outside the box is off the table? 🙂
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Post by riochforthereebok on Mar 11, 2024 10:29:12 GMT
When Nat Lofthouse was injured, Bill Ridding put Malcolm Barrass at centre forward and he scored a hat-trick. I think Forrester could do that. Why not give it a try ? That’s a very interesting point Kenglo and I was trying to think who we could utilise up front to add a bit something different but I hadn’t thought of Forrester doing it. Either way I don’t see Evatt changing much because he doesn’t go for the high cross method which is why he doesn’t sign players who can do that. I suppose it would mean a complete change but sometimes if situations demand a change good managers make them, as you illustrated with Bill Ridding. Sadly Evatt isn’t BR and I don’t think anything will make him change his system so it looks like thinking outside the box is off the table? 🙂 Great idea Ken Although I think Ian will go for Gilkes up front
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Post by owdonlad on Mar 11, 2024 12:20:14 GMT
When Nat Lofthouse was injured, Bill Ridding put Malcolm Barrass at centre forward and he scored a hat-trick. I think Forrester could do that. Why not give it a try ? The difference was Matt was already capped as an internatonal forward (only one cap ) anf full games are not the place you play silly games , now if you had said drop Santos that would be very welcome in my eyes as he unfit and it show ,no speed ,looses track of the game and is slow to re-act to needy situations .
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Post by realtrottersforever on Mar 11, 2024 12:31:01 GMT
nice little vid about Dick Pym, who i mentioned earlier on this thread having played for both clubs.
played in 3 FA cup finals for us. won them all. 3 clean sheets. & that is still a record to this day. forget Jussi and Hopkinson , as great as they were, this guy is surely the number 1 contender for the keeper in our greatest ever team.
Hopkinson of course got a clean sheet in his FA cup final win too.
. we've not had one away in 2024. we scored 2 at Barnsley . scored 2 at Exeter. but conceded 2 in both, yet still defensive issues seem less relevant than striking ones, to some on here. you shouldn't have to score 3 away to get a win i would say.
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Post by realtrottersforever on Mar 11, 2024 12:38:39 GMT
another little good vid about Dick Pym.
so much crammed into 1 min 10.
enlisted in WW1 and saw action at the Somme.
at 0.44 in the vid. the police horse Billy, in the "white horse final " was actually grey, but showed up White on the film of the day.
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Post by kenglowhite on Mar 11, 2024 14:58:15 GMT
Owdonlad I have to say there are many Wanderers supporters at the moment thinking selection has been akin to "silly games". Forrester is a long way from a "silly game", a big lad who has already shown an ability to go for goal. As an inside left Barrass had been a joke, even with a victory international cap, and he was always regarded as having trouble with his feet , but he became a very good centre half. while at the goalfront his physique prevailed as a Lofthouse substitute.
People constantly call for a Plan B. Why not an occasional attempt at creative thinking by Ian Evatt?
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Post by whitesince63 on Mar 11, 2024 18:34:52 GMT
Unfortunately Kenglo, Evatt doesn’t do creative thinking. His mantra is to continue to apply the same system until its second nature to the players so that whatever happens they continue on. There is no plan B just a belief that his plan A will always come through. It can of course be seen as stubborn but it may also be seen as committed to what he believes in and can be seen as admirable.. Whichever way it goes unless the players both believe in it and can effect it properly no system works. I may be in a minority on here but I’m in the admire club because it’s got us where we are right now and I have to rely on the players to stop cocking up at both ends and start implementing the system properly. This week will be a mighty test for the players so come the international break we’ll have a pretty good idea where we’re going to finish. I still think we’ll make top two and start that tomorrow by beating Oxford and I’ll go 2-0 to Wanderers.
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Post by kenglowhite on Mar 11, 2024 22:40:54 GMT
I have no disagreement with your main points, 63, but as we are almost out of strikers at the moment my idea was supposed to be helpful to Ian in finding a suitable stop-gap solution, the sort of thing that Bill Ridding in his heyday was able to do. He used Johnnie Wheeler and later Ralph Gubbins in that way, too.
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Post by OohMac on Mar 11, 2024 23:25:34 GMT
I’m not going to deny any of the points you make rioch, in fact I agree with most of them but again I’d only reiterate that I don’t think it’s the system that’s wrong in itself but the way it’s applied. When we play it quickly we absolutely kill teams but I agree when it’s slowly, slowly sideways with Rico standing on the ball it drives me nuts but I can’t believe that Evatt directs the players to be that slow. Yes, keep the ball until gaps occur but when it gets too slow gaps won’t appear and that’s where we get stuck because nobody seems to have either the confidence or just plain nouse to do anything about it because it’s been drilled into them so much by Evatt. Either way this system has got us to where we are so it must have been working to a point but recently less well. I’m still behind Evatt and the system but I must admit to becoming less convinced recently that the players we have can carry it out. Our injuries to key players has hit us badly and I’m not sure the replacements are as capable of seeing us home. It doesn’t look good for Dion and probably Victor as well and with CMG and Dan still out longer term I think we’re stuck with what we’ve got. I agree on the set pieces, we’re absolutely woeful and totally lacking a threat and that’s been that way all through Evatt’s reign because we’ve never had a striker that can attack a ball or use physical strength because that’s just not Evatts way. If we fail this week then as you say we could even fall out of the play offs but to be honest I really don’t see that happening at all. We’re still in it and if we can profit from this week we’ll still be on track. I think we’ll do well so call me over optimistic if you like. 😁 I'm not sure if it's the system he plays or the ethos he has but it's wrong. We're now playing with strikers who've had 18 months and not scored a league goal. Evatts always allowed sub par strikers get away with it because they run about. That needs to end now. It's not enough. It's embarrassing to have 6 strikers on the roster. And 5 of them be short on goals. 4 woeful in the single figures. And Jerome on 0.
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