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Post by davidm on May 19, 2024 8:13:37 GMT
An absolute nightmare.
This joins Stoke, Tranmere, Watford and Bristol City in the Wembley let-downs.
- Bad tactics.
- Inability to react to problems
- Casual, soft approach
- Zero shots on target
Everything was wrong.
- Defence was slow and just gave up marking.
- Midfield was non existent once Oxford gave us a few early kicks. The number of times we lost possession from rank poor passing.
- Attack got no service,
£86 for a ticket plus travel costs adds to the misery
Marks:-
Baxter - 3 No fault for the 1st goal (thank you Santos!). Too slow coming out for the 2nd goal and then a ridiculous exhibition of panic for most of the second half.
Dacres-Cogley - 2 Gave Murphy much too much space for the 1st goal. Sloppy defending throughout. Almost gave another goal away from our corner.
Jones - 2 Too slow. Endlessly outpaced. Got caught sleeping for the 2nd goal. When he went to RWB in the 2nd half, his passing was bad. Got booked after a rank bad display of ball control.
Santos - 1 Fundamental to all our problems. Played walking football and endlessly gave the ball away. If you are going to put your head in the way of a shot, make sure you head it – not deflect it out of the way of the keeper. This “foot on the ball” tactic was horrific. Looked unfit.
Toal - 3 Lost way too many headers. His passing seemed to consist of only being able to pass sideways to Santos
Ogbeta - 2 Dreadful. The few times he got forward he over hit his centres. He tried to replicate Williams’ corner at Barnsley every time and continually just put the ball out of play
Sheehan - 3 Had our only decent shot but it is hard to remember any decent incisive forward passes.
Maghoma - 2 Got knocked in the 1st minute. After that, he shied away from tackles. He twice backed out of a tackle and let an Oxford man run free into the area. He then backed out of a 50/50 in the build up to the 2nd goal.
Thomason - 2 Apart from his usual booking (that’s a booking in every play-off match!) I cannot remember one instance of a positive forward pass.
Charles - 2 No service but also no ball control. Easily shrugged off the ball.
Collins - 3 Like Charles, no service. Tried to make things happen. Finished up embarrassingly diving to try and win a penalty.
Dempsey - 3 Came on, immediately got involved in the match and then faded
Jerome - 3 At least he got involved. Headed over from a half chance
Adeboyejo - 3 Not much chance to get involved
Iredale - 2 Comes on and immediately gave the ball away. Terrible passing
Manager - 1 Failed to adapt to the situation. Allowed the walking football to carrying on for the whole of the 1st half. Why not change things early on when it was clear that Oxford had sussed us out? Woeful.
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Post by davidm on May 19, 2024 8:17:03 GMT
Oxford won this in the first five minutes when Brannegan twice fouled Maghoma and Sheehan and didn't receive a card. I tend to agree with this. Teams (Wigan, Barnsley …) have learned that if you kick our midfield men early on they fade out of the game. Maghoma may as well have come off after 1 minute as he chickened out of every tackle after that.
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Post by andyl on May 19, 2024 8:55:28 GMT
Fortunately, the injury that kept me away from late March also denied me this debacle. I'll offer a wider reflection on another thread, afforded by said degree of unusual detachment- this may contrast slightly with what most of you are saying in the intermediate aftermath. My main comment here though is that far from being 'unrecognisable' ( IE), were all too similar to our stereotyped performance which is why Des Buckingham was, as indeed other managers have, so comprehensively. able to neuter and counter our threat.
I do think a long season and lingering injuries to Baxter, Toal, Jones, Santos, Williams and others took their toll-with key defenders a yard short of their best- and this looking back has been evident for a couple of months.
Santos, as I have remarked a myriad times does not seem to be able to jump to head a ball or to mark a man. I think all the Peterboro, two of the Barnsley and both of Oxford's goals were attributable to these deficiencies, the first because he just got a head on it rather than headed and the second because he had wandered forward with no capacity to recover--watch him closely- a slow dispirited turn. I have never understood why he goes up for corners when he offers so little on set pieces yet exposes us to counter attacks, which Jones and Dacres- Cogley cannot cover.
I think Marc Iles player marking is entirely inconsistent with his marks throughout the season when he seldom goes below 6. His comments are fairer from what I saw on TV.
Santos and Jones apart I didn't really see players who had personal bad games, although Ogbeta was lightweight. I saw poor crosses from Jones, Dacres-Cogley , Ogbeta and Collins but only one each. I think Sheehan and Thomason tried throughout, the former preventing a likely third goal and Thomason on the ball a lot but Oxford, better than any team I've seen eliminating his left foot threat and forcing him to turn back repeatedly.
I don't think Collins and Charles stood much of a chance in context - and that is credit to Oxford and has happened to many forwards better than them. I do think Maghoma was crocked early on and credit to him for trying to keep going-he did actually do one or two things but I agree in hindsight that Dempsey could have come on. I thought Adeboyejo and Jerome both tried hard and made a couple of moments happen.
In sum my opinion is that we met an in-form team when we were depleted and that scissors met stone. We haven't got a player as good as Brannigan and it makes a difference. Our failures and strengths this season are systemic but are all of League 1 not Championship standard, alas.
Relative to how I've marked all season - and I think this is fairer than out of immediate depression( the game was very like watching us at Orient), I'd go
Baxter 6 Jones 4 Santos 2 Toal 5 Ogbeta 4 Thomason 6 Sheehan 6 Maghoma 5 Dacres-Cogley 5, Charles 5 Collins 6 ( Dempsey 5 Adeboyejo 5 Iredale 5)
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Post by realtrottersforever on May 19, 2024 10:56:19 GMT
Watching the highlights, ( i didn't go, and didn't see it live..radio only for me. ) I noticed that their keeper Jamie Cumming kicked it long most times. looking at the stats on whoscored, it looks like he kicked it long every single time. I know it's not the sort of thing you notice unless you really force yourself to pay attention to it, but did anyone else notice this. ?? surprised me as I always expect these young ( wet behind the ears ) no mark managers to do the usual play out routines we see "infecting" the game.
smart stuff Des B to take that approach and minimise risks. wonder if this is one thing he switched from the 5-0. i'll have a look into that. Cumming was a top keeper in lge 2...remember talking about him when i used to do the more detailed match previews. was on loan out from Chelsea, so clearly had shown some talent. he did not impress at all in the 5-0 thrashing.
Cumming's gloves are up for auction on Ebay for charity if anyone interested ..... completely unmarked...as new !
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Post by riochforthereebok on May 19, 2024 13:12:04 GMT
CHALLINOR
I see Sarcevic has been released by Stockport
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Post by riochforthereebok on May 19, 2024 21:01:21 GMT
Go on, I’ll say it.
How ridiculous a suggestion is it that we threw that game (based on Sharon Brittan’s £20 million comment)
If you look down the years for similar tales, Sam Langson didn’t want Derby having any European involvement as they were apparently spending on the upgrade of the Baseball Ground
Big Sam was allegedly told ‘we can’t afford to go into Europe by Darkside AND ALSO “what do you want John Carew for, you’ve got Anelka”
Of course, these were only hearsay from the terraces, but then why let the truth get in the way of a good rumour
Is there any mileage in this £20m comment??
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Post by whitesince63 on May 19, 2024 22:43:46 GMT
No.
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Post by andyl on May 20, 2024 8:06:13 GMT
Definitely not. The players all had ambition. Maybe just a smidgeon of relief elsewhere?
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Post by kenglowhite on May 20, 2024 19:40:09 GMT
Really, RFTR, you're capable of much worthier theories than that, which is being peddled on the BN site.
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Post by riochforthereebok on May 20, 2024 20:34:43 GMT
Really, RFTR, you're capable of much worthier theories than that, which is being peddled on the BN site. 🤣🤣 True ken Im trying everything I can to release the pressure and relieve the pain from that devastating defeat. It’s not even like Oxford were brilliant and that hurts even more, they just did a no nonsense attack on us, which we never got to grips with. Make no mistake, this was a nothing ‘performance’ in fact, performance is a strong word, ‘turned out onto the turf’ would be more apt If you instructed 11 men to just stand 4 4 2 and move no more than 1 foot in a Subbuteo type way, I think they’d have got a better result than the 11 that took to the field on Saturday, that was a disgraceful, disrespectful showing and heads must roll, starting with Evatt I thought the Sherpa Freight Bristol City game was tough to take, but the Watford one also took some beating, although this v Oxford is at the very very top when it comes to the worst ever Bolton showing in my46 years of watching them As the days go by, I’m actually feeling worse…. Instead of Leeds away, PNE at home, along with Burnley, Blackburn, Stoke, Sheff Wed, all ground fillers, we have the Emptihad experience watching Pep’s Wannabe dishing out more of the same droll and all with the prospect of going to Exeter, Crawley, Mansfield, Burton, Bristol Still, Birmingham might bring a few to the TuffShit Ah well Man I’m so fkn angry😡😡😡😡😡
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Post by kenglowhite on May 21, 2024 9:36:53 GMT
Ditto, Rioch, but I think rather than fling all the muck at the manager as so many are doing, I would rather turn to the physical tactics of Oxford, the early nasties from Brannagan, and the rookie referee who had no idea what he had come up against. We have seen it so many times with Wanderers over the years, and this is a body blow to our hopes of ever becoming a force again. The fact that we had beaten them so convincingly in March reminded me of the festive games we used to have in the old First, and once hitting six past Arsenal at home and succumbing two days later at Highbury. I was surprised to see our old pal Whites 63 gunning for Michael Appleton on the BN site amid a wave of hysteria, a guy who for me has never done it, while I prefer to think, with or without Ian Evatt, how our team can be strengthened and go on for next season from last Saturday.To be fair Whites had been advocating Evatt stays. That loss was so devastating, and so unexpected, but the only sobering thought is that this is football. So cheer up and let's have some constructive thinking about who stays , who goes, and who comes in. Doubt we'll see Connell back now.
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Post by riochforthereebok on May 21, 2024 11:17:37 GMT
Ditto, Rioch, but I think rather than fling all the muck at the manager as so many are doing, I would rather turn to the physical tactics of Oxford, the early nasties from Brannagan, and the rookie referee who had no idea what he had come up against. We have seen it so many times with Wanderers over the years, and this is a body blow to our hopes of ever becoming a force again. The fact that we had beaten them so convincingly in March reminded me of the festive games we used to have in the old First, and once hitting six past Arsenal at home and succumbing two days later at Highbury. I was surprised to see our old pal Whites 63 gunning for Michael Appleton on the BN site amid a wave of hysteria, a guy who for me has never done it, while I prefer to think, with or without Ian Evatt, how our team can be strengthened and go on for next season from last Saturday.To be fair Whites had been advocating Evatt stays. That loss was so devastating, and so unexpected, but the only sobering thought is that this is football. So cheer up and let's have some constructive thinking about who stays , who goes, and who comes in. Doubt we'll see Connell back now. MY CHOICES IN Baxter Coleman Toal Thomason Randell Sheehan Johnston Dempsey CMG Charles Collins OUT Santos- he’s not good enough Ogbeta - just NO Dacres Cogley - 10 games a season he might play ok Jones - There’s better out there surely? Jerome - offer him a coaching role Iredale - No Forrester - No JDB - he’s ok but out too often Nlundulu - needs loaning out to L2 Adeboyejo - just take that bandage off Vic, you’re not even injured , get rid Morley - used as a regular sub but hardly used, clearly Evatt doesn’t trust him EVATT - OUT - Time for a fresh challenge for him and for us LOANS Taylor - not seen enough of him to warrant a return Ashworth - as above Ramsay - as above Maghoma - worth another go at L1 level but doubt he’d have been much impact in the league above
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Post by whitesince63 on May 21, 2024 17:50:20 GMT
Ditto, Rioch, but I think rather than fling all the muck at the manager as so many are doing, I would rather turn to the physical tactics of Oxford, the early nasties from Brannagan, and the rookie referee who had no idea what he had come up against. We have seen it so many times with Wanderers over the years, and this is a body blow to our hopes of ever becoming a force again. The fact that we had beaten them so convincingly in March reminded me of the festive games we used to have in the old First, and once hitting six past Arsenal at home and succumbing two days later at Highbury. I was surprised to see our old pal Whites 63 gunning for Michael Appleton on the BN site amid a wave of hysteria, a guy who for me has never done it, while I prefer to think, with or without Ian Evatt, how our team can be strengthened and go on for next season from last Saturday.To be fair Whites had been advocating Evatt stays. That loss was so devastating, and so unexpected, but the only sobering thought is that this is football. So cheer up and let's have some constructive thinking about who stays , who goes, and who comes in. Doubt we'll see Connell back now. Kenglo, I wasn’t so much gunning for Appleton, I’d actually prefer Evatt to stay if he’s actually learned something from not just Saturday but in fact his whole tenure here that stubbornness is costing us but sadly I don’t think he will. Obviously you don’t want people to sacrifice their principles but I think it’s deeper than that with IE and he’d feel that if he changed it would somehow be seen as weakness, when in reality for me it would show great strength. Anyway, well hopefully find out which way soon but if Evatt does leave I’d certainly look at Appleton as a replacement.
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Post by whitesince63 on May 21, 2024 18:04:54 GMT
Ditto, Rioch, but I think rather than fling all the muck at the manager as so many are doing, I would rather turn to the physical tactics of Oxford, the early nasties from Brannagan, and the rookie referee who had no idea what he had come up against. We have seen it so many times with Wanderers over the years, and this is a body blow to our hopes of ever becoming a force again. The fact that we had beaten them so convincingly in March reminded me of the festive games we used to have in the old First, and once hitting six past Arsenal at home and succumbing two days later at Highbury. I was surprised to see our old pal Whites 63 gunning for Michael Appleton on the BN site amid a wave of hysteria, a guy who for me has never done it, while I prefer to think, with or without Ian Evatt, how our team can be strengthened and go on for next season from last Saturday.To be fair Whites had been advocating Evatt stays. That loss was so devastating, and so unexpected, but the only sobering thought is that this is football. So cheer up and let's have some constructive thinking about who stays , who goes, and who comes in. Doubt we'll see Connell back now. MY CHOICES IN Baxter Coleman Toal Thomason Randell Sheehan Johnston Dempsey CMG Charles Collins OUT Santos- he’s not good enough Ogbeta - just NO Dacres Cogley - 10 games a season he might play ok Jones - There’s better out there surely? Jerome - offer him a coaching role Iredale - No Forrester - No JDB - he’s ok but out too often Nlundulu - needs loaning out to L2 Adeboyejo - just take that bandage off Vic, you’re not even injured , get rid Morley - used as a regular sub but hardly used, clearly Evatt doesn’t trust him EVATT - OUT - Time for a fresh challenge for him and for us LOANS Taylor - not seen enough of him to warrant a return Ashworth - as above Ramsay - as above Maghoma - worth another go at L1 level but doubt he’d have been much impact in the league above Well rioch since most of those are still under contract I think you’d be hard pressed to see them all go and I’d also disagree that several of them should. I still believe when fit Santos is a benefit to us but only as a defender, nothing more and should be coaxed that way as well as relieved of the captaincy. I’m surprised you consider we should lose Forrester who to me has really impressed and I’d see him as replacement for Jones. Likewise I’d keep Johnson and see how he goes after his injury. Most of the rest I’d probably go along with but then if someone new came in they probably would play a different system and need players who suit that. We’ll soon know either way and then we can discuss with more certainty. 🙂
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