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Post by whitesince63 on Dec 6, 2020 14:09:24 GMT
In light of the booing yesterday and the furore from our woke football media, what do we think generally? Whilst everybody supports the anti racist theme, was it really about racism from the Millwall fans, or just a protest about a gesture that was appropriate at the time but has now become something annoying and past it’s sell by date? Personally, whilst I could understand and of course support a gesture to criticise what happened to George Floyd and highlight the need to fight racism in every form, I now consider it to be a totally unnecessary political statement which should cease. For me the FA should have stopped it at the end of the season when it had served its purpose and they brought out a new initiative. I’m not really sure what useful purpose it now serves and consider that it should have a clear end by date and move onto something that we can all get behind and doesn’t indicate a political point of view.
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Post by OohMac on Dec 6, 2020 16:30:58 GMT
Millwall's reputation of being lowest common denominator fans and they live up to it. First chance of getting to a match and before a ball is kicked they are the talking point.
That being said i'm not a fan of it. I dont think it has any weight behind it now because its become a ritual. Sort of like a non religious family saying grace before a meal because they think they should but its lip service. Lets get this over and done with quickly.
I think if there was ever any racism from the fans it would be an ideal scenario for all the players to stop, face the fans and take the knee. Refuse to play until those non fans are ejected or shamed into leaving.
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Post by realtrottersforever on Dec 6, 2020 18:06:25 GMT
it was all said on your last thread on this Whites & a lot of in your excellent opening post to that thread. how many months is it since Les Ferdinand came and said it's had it's time like NHS clapping. yet the Woke media refuse to even consider other points of view. like you say, the lack of end date bothers me. if we're just doing this forever..it'll prove exactly how futile it is..so i hope in a sense it does go on forever...just to prove how mad it is.
some good stuff on youtube saying how this Woke nonsense is like Puritanical religion. believe this or burn in hell. same rituals ..kneeling . unquestioned beliefs. if you question it, it isn't a matter of intellectual disagreement. you are EVIL. no other reasonable points of view exist. there is one view & that is our view. well if this one view was so obvious, why weren't you doing it 1 year ago or 5 years ago etc etc. Kick it out's been going longer than that and they never wanted it.
it's almost as if it's deliberately set up to cause this reaction...a self-fulfilling reaction..where they can say to themselves..told you so.
shame it had to be Millwall . as their reputation might spoil the legitimate points against it. conflicting reports of whether it happened at west ham too. most saying it did. BBC cut it very short on MOTD . I noticed the Chelsea game's knee moment was completely missed too .
how exactly is this futile gesture EVEN MEANT TO WORK. you've about as much chance of it stopping racism as you have it stopping burglary, or murder or litter. lets all kneel, hold hands and contact the living.
does the proof that Millwall fans revolted against it prove it didn't work. I don't suppose the media will consider that one.
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Post by whitesince63 on Dec 6, 2020 18:27:56 GMT
I never liked it rtf but like others I was happy to support what i thought it was meant to mean. I also anticipated it would be ceased at the end of the season when it had made its point but it hasn’t and there isn’t any sign of it stopping either. There are reports of similar reactions at other grounds as you say but of course being Millwall it was just too good for the media luvvies to miss. Nobody can say whether it was against the action itself, the black power raised arms of players, or just common old racism. Personally I think it was just a signal that this gesture has now gone on too long and is actually causing resentment and discord rather than uniting people together. If the FA can’t see that then they are likely to see a growing number of reactions like this at many more grounds that our woke media and broadcasters won’t be able to hide.
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Post by realtrottersforever on Dec 6, 2020 22:38:28 GMT
I never liked it rtf but like others I was happy to support what i thought it was meant to mean. I also anticipated it would be ceased at the end of the season when it had made its point but it hasn’t and there isn’t any sign of it stopping either. There are reports of similar reactions at other grounds as you say but of course being Millwall it was just too good for the media luvvies to miss. Nobody can say whether it was against the action itself, the black power raised arms of players, or just common old racism. Personally I think it was just a signal that this gesture has now gone on too long and is actually causing resentment and discord rather than uniting people together. If the FA can’t see that then they are likely to see a growing number of reactions like this at many more grounds that our woke media and broadcasters won’t be able to hide. hadn't actually seen this vid , when I made my reply above, but this pretty much sums up all the main ideas with this stuff. one i'm sure you'll like Whites.
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Post by realtrottersforever on Dec 6, 2020 23:30:27 GMT
in a similar vein..excellent stuff from Trevor Phillips and Andrew Neil. bit more intellectual but still very accessible. breaking down the nonsense of "critical race theory" that BLM and Woke types believe in. if it feels divisive and it's not bringing people together, that's because that is exactly what it believes and what it's aiming for.
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Post by whitesince63 on Dec 7, 2020 9:18:19 GMT
Common sense rtf, I’m afraid it will become increasingly divisive because there can’t be any question that this has now become in itself a racist signal. The right arm held aloft salute is nothing to do with taking the knee but a separate black power support. Could you even imagine a white player raising a white power salute, assuming there was such a thing? He would be absolutely crucified. In my view the supporters at Millwall and other grounds who boo’d did so to represent their frustration with the gesture more than any racist thoughts and I can only hope that more fans do it, including black ones, to ensure a proper discussion takes place from which an end to the signal can arise.
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Post by realtrottersforever on Dec 7, 2020 10:44:54 GMT
also happened at Colchester. convenient how it was made to seem it was only at Millwall.
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Post by realtrottersforever on Dec 7, 2020 11:41:31 GMT
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Post by riochforthereebok on Dec 7, 2020 13:02:14 GMT
I don’t want to go off topic with this #blm movement and it’s sad that it has come to this taking the knee in sport for the masses to recognise that there’s no room for racism in any walk of life, but I’m a bit stuck with the equal fairness of other issues that perhaps don’t get the right and fair attention such as sexism in sport. We’ve had and quite rightly so, the noted hand clap, the shirt logo and the minutes silence for both the #blm and also the treasured NHS nurses and doctors, but in general sport we’ve hardly seen or heard of much being said for sexism! 65% of women have suffered sexism in sport but only 10% are brave enough to speak out. Why then, has football not taken a stance against this before, during and after matches? As an aside to sport, sexism on TV is rife but little is done. TV adverts that show a man shaving or spraying deodorant in a very normal and non intrusive way and yet for the female advertising sanitary products, we get a zoomed in shot of all of her body and private parts. The men’s after shave advert is very James Bond’esq and sensible, whilst the female perfume equivalent shows her half naked. I was watching a documentary on the poor tragic case of the Sarah Payne murder with my girlfriend and they interviewed her little sister (who is now about 20yrs old) and the camera angle panned up from her feet to the top of her head, very very disgusting and completely inappropriate, so my two penneth for what it’s worth, says there ought to be more done about sexism in life and let’s make things equal and show as much awareness and respect as that of the #blm and the Rainbow Laces movement too
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Post by whitesince63 on Dec 7, 2020 17:07:26 GMT
I can’t disagree with you about women in sport being held back by sexism RTF but it is changing thanks to those women involved but I think we sometimes have to be realistic with some forms of advertising. For women I suppose it’s to encourage them to appreciate how the item might enhance their better charms. I don’t suppose the product would have the same appeal to 99% of women if the female used was a bruiser? Equally, if the man shaving was a skinny little runt I don’t imagine it would have the right affect to most men. I think you’ll have to just live with that one but I do wholeheartedly agree about some stereotyping as indicated by your point about Sarah Payne’s sister. I haven’t see it but it does sound highly inappropriate. I’m not sure we can totally compare the two things but improvement on both would be much appreciated.
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Post by Pedro on Dec 8, 2020 12:36:05 GMT
It snowed last night... 8:00 am: I made a snowman.
8:10 - A feminist passed by and asked me why I didn't make a snow woman.
8:15 - So, I made a snow woman.
8:17 - My feminist neighbor complained about the snow woman's voluptuous chest saying it objectified snow women everywhere.
8:20 - The gay couple living nearby threw a hissy fit and moaned it could have been two snow men instead.
8:22 - The transgender man..women...person asked why I didn't just make one snow person with detachable parts.
8:25 - The vegans at the end of the lane complained about the carrot nose, as veggies are food and not to decorate snow figures with.
8:28 - I was being called a racist because the snow couple is white.
8:31 - The middle eastern gent across the road demanded the snow woman be covered up .
8:40 - The Police arrived saying someone had been offended.
8:42 - The feminist neighbor complained again that the broomstick of the snow woman needed to be removed because it depicted women in a domestic role.
8:43 - The council equality officer arrived and threatened me with eviction.
8:45 - TV news crew from BBC showed up. I was asked if I know the difference between snowmen and snow-women? I replied "Snowballs" and am now called a sexist.
9:00 - I was on the News as a suspected terrorist, racist, homophobe sensibility offender, bent on stirring up trouble during difficult weather.
9:10 - I was asked if I have any accomplices. My children were taken by social services.
9:29 - Far left protesters offended by everything marched down the street demanding for me to be arrested.
By noon it all melted
Moral:
There is no moral to this story. It is what we have become, all because of snowflakes.
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Post by riochforthereebok on Dec 8, 2020 13:22:35 GMT
WOW Pedro Where did you cut and paste that from??
Moral of my story, it’s 2020 and we’ve moved on from old fashioned views on things and just demand equal respect as per my post. My points being that with sport being a powerful media, it’s a good vehicle to show fairness as per the #blm and rainbow laces etc but there’s still not enough being done for other issues that somewhat don’t get the correct media coverage they need My point being about the Sarah Payne documentary, the panning of the camera on this girl was so perverse, it was completely disgusting, unnecessary and ignored the point of programme which was about child molesting, raping, kidnapping and eventually murdering this poor young child. That’s not me being a snowflake, but if it is, then I’ll live with that so long as things are equalled up for the future Now.... Back to football and let’s hope for a win v Walsall
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Post by whitesince63 on Dec 8, 2020 14:03:44 GMT
Fantastic post Pedro and sadly rather an illustration of life in today’s woke society. It’s obviously an age thing and so as I’ve said before, I just let the younger generation get on with it because they’ll have to deal with the outcome from it. Rftr, I totally agree with you about women’s equality but there are still significant obstacles to overcome and it will only happen if women continue to push for it. We’ve had two women prime ministers and wouldn’t be surprised to see another before too long and our female sports teams and stars are gradually beginning to improve and impress. All these things take time but some of them you’ll have to accept living with for a while I’m afraid. From a purely football perspective, I wouldn’t actually be surprised to see a mixed team before long because some of the women I see playing are better than some men now. It’s starting in schools so as kids grow up they won’t see it as an issue like us oldies do. They say of course behind every good man there’s a good woman but also behind every good woman there’s a good man, looking at her bum!! 😉🤗
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Post by realtrottersforever on Dec 8, 2020 14:13:14 GMT
Millwall players will not take a knee before Tuesday's Championship fixture against QPR but will stand arm-in-arm in a "show of solidarity for football's fight against discrimination". www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/55223935good.. i hope it gets cheered to the rafters, which i'm 99% sure it will be. generally a better tone of report from the BBC, at least reporting an alternative view in this, rather than their own presumptions. " The Millwall Supporters' Club said the booing was not motivated by racism, but instead in opposition to the political views held by the Black Lives Matter organisation." which is directly from the article. although it still had to carry some nasty threatening line like this one : The FA has confirmed it is investigating the incident at Millwall, and a similar one at Colchester United's League Two game against Grimsby Town.
If it finds that the actions were discriminatory, the clubs could face fines.how are they going to prove this. ? maybe the F.A should stick to it's own rules..no political symbols in football. Guardiola got fined 20 grand for a yellow ribbon he wore supporting a Catalan cause. and warned about his future conduct. www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/43350447#:~:text=Manchester%20City%20manager%20Pep%20Guardiola,of%20kit%20and%20advertising%20regulations.
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