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Post by OohMac on Jan 12, 2020 11:58:46 GMT
I know ive put his frankly heads gone interview in the match thread but i was going to put this out anyway as ive heard a few murmurs about replacing Hill.
First i heard was after the Burton game and i thought and still think its absurd.
Hes had so many injuries, hes brought in freebies and for a while he got a tune out. Burton was the first time we lost a game for a while and one fairly rare home blip.
So to give an honest assessment.
The good - Daryl Murphy been a find and Hill choses to put his faith in young players. Whatever happens this season we will enter next season with far more experience. Had Hill had his squad in place at wycombe even with -12 we would have made a good go at it.
The bad - doesnt organise a defence and i dont think he does too much on set pieces. I dont think his game management is great as weve started well in games and thrown it away moments later. Accrington, Rotherham, Burton especially and almost let a very poor Southend back in when should have been done and dusted.
Also for me players not playing in the correct positions. No matter how much we are short bridcutt is wasted in defence and O grady on the wing? No thanks.
I also think Murphys red card was avoidable. After playing with 10 at shrewsbury Hill should realise we have a poor ref and make it clear not to risk anything. In the opponents half too was just stupid and i get the feeling if it was Weir, Politic etc there would be more fallout.
The ugly - his interviews and man management of younger players. One week his subbing Weir off and wont stand for it. He said Leasing trophy was to be taken seriously and then shrugs off a FA cup 1st round exit. Says he wants to push players to the limit and then weve a squad of injuries. Hes released players with no plan b.
I hope Keith reflects on his comments and makes an apology and in future learns to speak to the press in a professional way and not to stroke his ego, act like a philosopher or do a Jose. Remember out of work after Rochdale, lucky to be here really. Very lucky to have the fantastic support he has behind him.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2020 14:01:00 GMT
ive heard a few murmurs about replacing Hill. What's your source for that OohMac? Do you mean fans, or people in a professional capacity? I too wish Hill would take a different tack on his interviews, but he does have a difficult job. Signs palyers for half a season and then they're gone. Come on. Calling for his head, as per whites, is a bit premature. It would be a magician who could turn this around. Maybe Keith should go out on the p*ss with a few mates and relax a bit, then keep schtum.
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Post by OohMac on Jan 12, 2020 18:21:39 GMT
Nothing official just heard a few fans after the Burton game and listening to The Wanderers podcast they also said that some fans were asking questions of him.
Thats all it was.
In Parkys time i heard the phrase "small/some sections" "pockets of fans" or minority of people calling for change. In Parkys case think that was playing it down and believe with Hill until his tirade thats all it was.
Weirdly enough Iles put it out on twitter and asked for reactions. Most were like me utterly confused, lots came to hos defence, some dead against him including Neil Bonnar who straight out said "always the media to blame when things go wrong. I dont trust him".
A lot saying we missed a trick with Nolan. I dont agree. Think we still have the right man for the here and now. But as soon as Mark Warburton gets his customary QPR payoff then maybe time to reunite FV with Warburton.
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Post by whitesince63 on Jan 13, 2020 9:52:26 GMT
ive heard a few murmurs about replacing Hill. What's your source for that OohMac? Do you mean fans, or people in a professional capacity? I too wish Hill would take a different tack on his interviews, but he does have a difficult job. Signs palyers for half a season and then they're gone. Come on. Calling for his head, as per whites, is a bit premature. It would be a magician who could turn this around. Maybe Keith should go out on the p*ss with a few mates and relax a bit, then keep schtum. wots, where did I say I was calling for his head? If I’ve misled anybody apologies but I don’t ever recall doing that. I’m right behind him but that’s not without criticism of some of the things he’s done. It’s true he wouldn’t have been my choice and if he doesn’t improve things in the second half of the season, then maybe I will consider it’s time to think about a replacement. He’s had a tough gig so far and injuries and sendings off have limited his hand, so that is certainly a reason for underperformance but assuming he has more luck in future I’ll expect much more from him.
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Post by one2many on Jan 13, 2020 12:01:22 GMT
Unless KH is mad (which is always a possibility) I doubt he would have said what he said without some basis. It seems we don't know who has said things, nor what has been said, but there is no smoke without fire. Personally I hadn't even considered KH's position and get the impression most fans feel the same. He had no pre season, has jumbled together a squad at the absolute last minute and would always be playing catch up on the other teams in the division.
I would judge him on what he does next year, presumably in L2, after a full preseason and time to assemble a squad more of his choosing.
In saying all that, I agree with those who say he should have shut up and just concentrated on the football. He seems to have created an unnecessary debate.
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Post by thegrud1 on Jan 13, 2020 14:01:10 GMT
Lets have some sense here.....he had to play youngsters...players who had no pre season...cobble together a squad from players that really no one else wanted on a shoestring budget and some fans think we should be winning most games...give the guy some credit!!!
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Post by OohMac on Jan 13, 2020 15:52:12 GMT
Unless KH is mad (which is always a possibility) I doubt he would have said what he said without some basis. It seems we don't know who has said things, nor what has been said, but there is no smoke without fire. Personally I hadn't even considered KH's position and get the impression most fans feel the same. He had no pre season, has jumbled together a squad at the absolute last minute and would always be playing catch up on the other teams in the division. I would judge him on what he does next year, presumably in L2, after a full preseason and time to assemble a squad more of his choosing. In saying all that, I agree with those who say he should have shut up and just concentrated on the football. He seems to have created an unnecessary debate. He qualified this by saying he doesnt read papers or social media. So its people he knows and trusts that are telling him. Flitcroft, family and friends. Do i buy that? Not really. If someone lost his job last year would you be keen to point out his perceived shortcomings by some. I would hope my family and friends would spare me that. And ive no idea why Neil Bonnar feels so against him but got to be something in that.
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Post by whitesince63 on Jan 13, 2020 19:23:28 GMT
Lets have some sense here.....he had to play youngsters...players who had no pre season...cobble together a squad from players that really no one else wanted on a shoestring budget and some fans think we should be winning most games...give the guy some credit!!! but I think we have all given him credit Grud. Everybody knew we’d struggle but to be fair we don’t seem to have made any progress at all. Much of that is as you say down to young, unfit and unwanted players but some of it must also be down to the coaching. It’s too early to be calling for his head but he has to recruit well in this window and make more of a fist of it in the second half of the season for me if we are to prosper next year. I think he does know that and is now trying to recruit with that in mind so let’s see eh?
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Post by OohMac on Jan 15, 2020 9:58:19 GMT
For the first time in a long long time ive felt angry at a defeat. Prior to this just felt numb even Rotherham and Accrington. Think last night i just wanted a reply but what angered me is how self destructive is all is.
On the main page and maybe on here. A few made the point that if we sacked Parky how long before we turned on the new man? I thought i'd never be calling for a shake up. Especially with the assembled team for the reduced aisle plus the injuries, but Keith Hill has put his foot in his mouth too many times. Not since Ed Milliband tackle a bacon sandwich have i seen such a nose dive in popularity.
Before Hills outburst i still thought he had the full/majority backing and lots of sympathy. With this, other interviews and a catastrophic January window the feeling i get now is the man may be Bolton. Born with a carrs pasty barm in his hand and all that but the man has lost the plot.
Lets not forget before we came in. Hill was out of work having been sacked by the only club hes had any sort of success from. Had he not been Boltonian he probably would be keeping an eye on Macclesfield, Oldham, Chesterfield jobs. So its not about favours on both parts.
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Post by whitesince63 on Jan 15, 2020 10:29:58 GMT
It’s a difficult one OM. I’m not angry just apathetic, in fact I couldn’t even be bothered to follow the BN blog on the game. I think judging by the number of missing posters on here and other sites, many are feeling the same. I keep thinking that one day the team will wake up and actually start producing but I think that’s more in hope than expectation. What are we to do? Clearly the easy option is just to blame KH and Flicks and sack them. Problem solved? Well no because we’d probably only get someone similar for the money on offer and be no better off. We shouldn’t underestimate the difficulties KH is working under but the question is, how well is he dealing with it? On that score I’d have to say not very well. I would have hoped by now that he would at least have the core of a decent team but we don’t even have that. To me there is no sign that the team as a whole is actually a team. I accept we’ve had injuries but I still think he chops and changes too much and never lets the players learn to gel with each other. It may take 5 or 6 games with poor results but at least you could see something developing. At the moment I see nothing developing, just us if anything going backwards. I didn’t want Keith Hill, I’d personally have given the job to David Lee and Tony Kelly for what they achieved with the Development Squad but FV went with him and Flicks so we have to give them to at least the end of the season. If things are still like this then we can’t possibly trust him to deliver next season when non league would be a distinct possibility, if not probability. Again I’d turn to DL because I just can’t believe, inexperienced or not, that he couldn’t do better than our current two.
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Post by riochforthereebok on Jan 15, 2020 12:42:41 GMT
W63 David Lee starting the job off with Football Ventures would have been my first choice. Instead, the club dragged on with Parkinson to the point where HE decided that the Doncaster game was too much for the young legs. The club were on a hiding to nothing with very little support from the EFL with penalties and the like, but I still believed we had enthusiastic kids that could, over time, have given us a decent platform to start off with in L2. Come on, let’s face it, we knew we were going down, I just didn’t see we would be submitting so easily and so pathetically. The alternative to all of this was to give the job to KH and look where that is taking us! I do feel somewhat two faced though as when Rochdale where flying and Barnsley came a calling, I really thought Keith Hill had something and that something might have been what we needed in the style of a BSA, a gruff talking no nonsense manager. NOW!!!!! I just wish he’d pack his bags and take Flitcroft with him I’ve said it before, Dale fans warned us of his legendary ramblings and desires to be thrust upon the TV cameras for any interviews he could get and they’ve certainly been proved right. Looking at the BN forum and on here, I honestly didn’t see it coming so quickly how savage we would all become in baying for Keith’s blood, but if he’s not a dead man walking already then serious questions need to be asked of Brittan, Beaugeard and Mason as to what the future holds for BWFC in their tenure
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Post by kenglowhite on Jan 15, 2020 12:59:09 GMT
I totally agree with this from RFTR. It is very interesting that we have heard nothing from Dave Lee or any of the others all season. There has also been no reporting of the Under 23s or the youth team on the BN. Have all the other coaches been shut up? I have seen a view expressed that Hill is under pressure frpm FV, not least in having to cancel Chicken's registration (note his Bradford origins - amnpther prevbiously lined up by PP). I can honestly say that in a lifetome watching BWFC, not even in the darkest days of the 70s or the 80s I have had to witness such a trail of appalling results. We are all pleased to still have a club, but if this goes opn we will no longer wich to own it. Isn't it time for a comment from the owners, or maybe an announcement about a manager who knows what the club really needs.
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Post by OohMac on Jan 15, 2020 16:56:54 GMT
On further reflection sacking Hill is not something I want or think should happen. First time hes lost back to back and then a third. Throw into the mix that 2 of those were away and 1 was with 10 men.
As a fan im certainly used to these sorts of runs and think its far too easy to be talking about replacing Hill.
But whats come out of this is just how little hes thought of from other fans. And how hes got under my skin.
Whether or not there were fans underwhelmed by the appointment so waited in the wings for first blip im not sure.
In my case certainly not. I listened to Hill and Flitcroft and what it meant to them and genuinely was won over. Anyone but Parky was a breath of fresh air.
Fans will say we were always down. Thats not how i felt. Not after Bristol and Fleetwood or even winning after a missed penalty. Even the Southend, where they were usless. They still got 3 goals and won. They had something about them.
After that Southend win i would have rated our chances of survival at 30/70. Still a massive ask but have the tools. For some reason those odds were too long, or short, so that blueprint was ripped up with no real method or logic to follow. Survival chances now 5%? So even now 20 points or so behind i still think this league is so poor that we could tighten up keep clean sheets and go on a 6 or 7 win streak. But no evidence with this squad and under this leadership.
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Post by kenglowhite on Jan 15, 2020 19:25:28 GMT
I'm not used to this sort of run, Oom. Even in the late Sixties and then the Eighties it was grim but scores weren't as bad as this. I am not too convinced by the theory either that FV have put the skids under Keith Hill, or that they are underfunded..If they are the latter then they should not have been cleared to take over by the EFL. If they are the people I hope they are they will be taking a close look at recent non-events and seeking to get management in who can fulfill the optimism we felt after the takeover. If they feel their hands are tied for any reason, now is the time to let us know in order to keep the support of us fans, many of whom by now must be feeling very disenchanted,
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Post by OohMac on Jan 15, 2020 20:28:26 GMT
Yeah i dont agree that FV have thrown the towel in. Best defence weve had was fighting the appeal and winning. Only to watch that.
I do think had it not been for No Ken Do. FV would have Mark Warburton in place already. Unfortunately by the time they got it sorted was a straight shoutout between Hill and Nolan. No doubt Hill spoke for 40mins about what Keith Hill id all about and tipped it with what they believe was ambition and enthisiasm. They probably thought his monologue was deeper and probably hired him rather than admit they hadnt a clue what he was banging on about.
I think Hill can win people back but will take 3 wins on the spin and a post match mime instead of words.
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