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Post by andyl on Dec 8, 2021 10:45:09 GMT
It's hard to know what to make of post match comments or today's press.
Firstly if Politic isn't ready for return because he has not played enough at Port Vale, how is Amaechi, who is not ours even now, worthy of an extended contract? He has hardly played and has done even less?
Secondly, the Santos problem screams out. He simply cannot mark men and the great majority of recent goals against have been the result of this. Johnston gets criticism , some deserved but at least he puts his body in and doesn't half turn. Contrast and compare how easily Johnson later cleared a near post cross near enough identical to the opening goal where the forward stole a march.
When the forward misses the early second half open goal and then on the dismissal just look how Santos ball watches and leaves his man free- we saw it repeatedly in Stockport and Wigan games and indeed most since. Just maybe he can play some part in midfield-- yet again glimpses of that last night but his role at the moment seems to involve only passing the ball about at the back prettily and slowly and lolloping up for set pieces he gets nowhere near with his head. OK one probably good but ruled offside tap in and one screwed shot at home but zilch in the air. He's pretty desperate in the air at both ends, merely getting a head on a ball is not enough. And if this seems like a diatribe from me it's because he has been truly terrible since Gilks was behind him. Is it confidence as Evatt hints? That may be showing in that he hardly ever surges forward just now, even with lots of opportunity to do so. But why load an out of form player with captaincy which demands an excess of confidence if anything?
I really don't know if Evatt is overwhelmed by circumstance and limited resource or just too rigid and indeed not a very good coach or tactician. The Sarcevic episode does seem to have been a watershed- he was very in and out but if reflecting on the Evatt era Sarcevic was central to most of the highs?
It's not all bad. I do think Lee is a good player and rather disagree with other assessments of his game last night. I thought he was everywhere for seventy minute of the game. Also Thomason and Gordon, young as they are are showing signs of quality even if inconsistently so. Also Kachunga is if not strong fairly sure footed, holds a ball quite well and offers something in the air and on the ground in the box or cutting along the by-line.
But we lack strength and presence in goal, at centre back and upfront and without remedy that is a recipe for some heavy and embarrassing defeats and a tough relegation fight.
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Post by davidm on Dec 8, 2021 12:51:20 GMT
Some comments the day after the night before – and it still feels as bad as at 90 minutes last night.
1. We won the toss of the coin and chose to kick facing the wind in the first half. That must have been pre-determined by the management so why then did we regularly hoof the ball up into the air with the result that we lost possession each time. We are a team that supposedly like to pass the ball along the floor. We ignored this last night. Somewhere the weather conditions got into the manager’s head and he abandoned all our passing principles with the incorrect belief that kicking the ball high and long would work.
2. We are such slow starters. Again, it must come from the management who should be instilling into the players how important a good start is.
3. Saying as how we had a whole week to practice our formation for last night, it was awful. Their first goal came from Gordon being left in a 2 on 1 position. No one (Aimson?) came across to help cover the attack.
4. Santos is not a good defender. I agree with all that AndyL says about him. Somewhere in his mind, there is a mis-belief that he is superior to run of the mill league 1 attackers and he can easily dispossess them. He stands 2 yards away from them and expects to be able to get to the ball. The 1st goal last night and twice in the 2nd half, including the sending off, were down to this. Off the top of my head, goals against Sheff Wed, Gillingham, Charlton, Ipswich were all down to his poor defending.
5. Santos is also not a good captain. In fact, we are desperately short of leaders/drivers on the pitch
6. Yet again the goalkeeping leaves a lot of questions. Yes, he makes good one on one stops but the threat from high crosses and the poor distribution stand out. Their first goal was started with a poor kick from Dixon.
7. The lack of a tackler in midfield beat us last night. Fleetwood regularly just won the ball from our men and stopped the build up of most attacks.
8. Attack wise, we are toothless. Doyle & Kachunga both had reasonable half chances and shot so weakly and straight at the keeper. Afolayan has seemingly given up. He just strolls about to no effect. Now that defences have learned to double mark him, he is just coasting along, getting nowhere.
9. As has been said all season, dead ball situations are embarrassing. Do we ever practice corners?
10. The lack of heart/enthusiasm was summed up in the final 10 minutes. Yes, we were a beaten side but we basically gave up. There was no challenge at all when Fleetwood just chose to pass the ball back and forth amongst their men. We just stood off and effectively gave up.
It was as bad as the Stockport and Wigan performances with little or no direction from the manager.
Defeat on Saturday could see us very close to the relegation places.
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Post by riochforthereebok on Dec 8, 2021 13:15:21 GMT
Some fantastic posts from davidm AndyL RTF W63 OoM One2 Only wish Ian Evatt was a member of this forum!
Why is we always turn completely shit in December It’s meant to be the time of good cheer Works going well Kids are all good House is in tip top order
And then…… Flood warnings Government cock ups Wanderers turn shit in December
It’s a bit like Groundhog Day
Someone mentioned summat on the radio this morning “It’s like Santa has visited your house on Christmas Eve and trashed your living room, whilst stealing all the presents under the tree”
OooM mentioned Paul Cook as unemployed, don’t think he got enough time at Ipswich but he did a great job in keeping Wigan up in the Championship until they got deducted 12 points and went into administration. He’d get my vote to replace the man who peaked back in May with that Crawley win
I can almost feel another 7-0 debacle at Accrington again Note how I said 7-0 as I cannot see us scoring Every other manager has gotten a tune out of Eioin Doyle apart from Evatt
One other thing, our old boss Lennon is on the shortlist for Ipswich 😬😬
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Post by OohMac on Dec 8, 2021 13:40:26 GMT
Keep going back to the point. We are almost exactly where we were last season. Looking over our shoulders, incapable of clean sheets, conceding soft goals.
We brought in Premier league prospects and championship players who have no right to be in L2.
Its like if Newcastle owner gives Howe £200M and he brings in champions league players and they finish 10th. Would anyone say "wow, what a turnaround, hes worked wonders. What a job hes done" or would it be yeah of course he has done that, even Bruce would had done it.
Promotion was gained by him binning off his recruits (who he managed/played with)and replacing them. We had easily the best squad by a long way.
Had we kept that side but they all started doing better looking like there was the method coming through, that would have been impressive. Bielsa used L1 players, As did Chris Wilder, in the prem.
And I keep going back to that interview Evatt did whilst still Barrow manager. When he talks about his non negotiables. Fitness levels, winning the ball back in 6 seconds, running, grafting, setting strikers 30 goal targets. Have we seen any of these. They're non negiotable because the players wont consider doing it, it seems.
May think this is harsh but think Evatt is a phony. An ego who likes a soundbyte. Set unrealistic goals and is getting it becsuse his ego exceeds his talent.
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Post by kenglowhite on Dec 8, 2021 17:07:46 GMT
Made my point earlier about the Santos red in the belief that it was a professional foul, and from all accounts it seems now to have been for serious foul play. Certainly didn't see it that way and thought the referee had mistaken him for the last man preventing a goal. Haven't had the patience to see a replay. What do others think? On the comments in general criticising Santos, it also strikes me that his performances deteriorate depending on who is around him. I found it difficult to tell whether Aimson or Johnston was given the Williams DM role last night, and Gordon didn't give home much help either. It is a pity Baps is nearing retirement as he has not been effectively replaced.
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Post by andyl on Dec 8, 2021 20:05:54 GMT
I may be a bit out of date but I think that 'serious foul play' is and was the umbrella classification of what in popular jargon we call a 'professional foul.
Re my opinion I was 100% clear that Santos tripped the opponent when he was speeding through on goal and would have had a clear shooting opportunity. Gordon could not have provided cover, so correct decision.
The commentators were in general poor on Ifollow, I thought. They came down hard on the referee when he brought play back to give a freekick to Fleetwood after first allowing an advantage when Thomason clattered into an opponent in almost a copy of an earlier challenge by a Fleetwood player. I do think the referee allowed the advantage to go on too long before halting play but his main mistake then was not to give a yellow card to Thomason and some justice was done in that we weren't allowed to break away. I do despair though of players lying prostrate expecting play to be stopped. As a rough rule of thumb if they hit their hand on the ground repeatedly or lie prostrate but looking around they will most of the time be playacting. It's so difficult because safety must come first. What also baffles me is why referees don't these days order the walking wounded or those adjacent to touchlines to leave the field when they clearly can.
Dapo is our prime embarrassment. One of these days he will rightly pick up two yellows for play acting or one such yellow will add to another offence and get him sent off-- and if that does happens few tears will be shed around leagues one and two.
Re Santos I called for him to be subbed at half time because I could see something like that happening or just more goals conceded. If I could see that why not Evatt who is paid to see it.
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Post by realtrottersforever on Dec 8, 2021 22:33:45 GMT
definite pen. freeze the vid at 1.06 . Fleetwood player is clear through. no way Santos is not the last man. Gordon is relatively close, but irrelevant, as the ball is drifting slightly right, not left. Fleetwood player clearly would have got a shot in. Santos has a nerve to even argue with the ref over that one.
more bad decision making from Santos at 0.48 in the vid. Aimson makes a mini-hash of a long pass out of their defence. it flirts up. Santos stands watching and then jogs ever so slowly. by the time he finally gets going, he does catch up pretty quickly but not quick enough to stop the shot.
I always remember defensive pundits..possibly Hansen talking about centre backs pairings working as a team, you deal with it...i'll cover. Lawro also used to say...the best defenders are pessimists. Santos leaving it to Aimson as if he'll not be needed. he should be presuming HE WILL be needed and get on the cover.
I had a quick skim thru' the ifollow full match replay. noticed Evatt went straight down the tunnel at Full time. shook hands with the interim manager of Fleetwood ( yeah remember that too !). 3-0 to an interim manager !! . didn't go part-way to BWFC fans & applaud or do it from a safe distance. surprised that not getting many mentions. found this on twitter but it was from similar incident..Pompey away. i beleive near the end, the fans were chanting Evatt sort it out, but it possibly got stronger than that later on.
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Post by one2many on Dec 9, 2021 10:06:13 GMT
As to why IE did not come and applaud the fans, I guess he rushed inside to look for an umbrella before realising the team had forgotton to pack one for the trip. Shame, we could have had another "wally with the brolly" headline.
Mental note Ian. Practice set pieces, general basic defending in the first 20 minutes and put an umbrella in the kit bag.
Equally he may have been just bursting for a wee.
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Post by realtrottersforever on Dec 9, 2021 11:20:39 GMT
that's what you call management, rather than waiting for Auntie Sharron to bail you out again. ( the 2nd tweet specifically ). ( nb it might take a sec or 2 to load )
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Post by OohMac on Dec 10, 2021 8:07:31 GMT
To be honest that Wycombe comparison/business model will be fuel for the happy clappers. They'll say Ainsworth has been given time and managed to build success on and off.
I think Evatt gets caught out in his web of lies and delusions. So his comments get twisted and turned and make him, and us, lool amateur. And this goes back to the imitation syndrome he suffers from.
For example I genuinely believe Evatt only said we didnt need another striker "ansolute nonsense" because at the same time Pep was saying the same thing having failed to land Kane. Arent they two peas from the same pod?
When you have a plan and give honest answers(as he claims he always does) you rarely get caught out in contradictions. You might upset some fans with the truth and maybe the board but most fans can see it for what it is.
Sarce and Politic are too examples talking enough BS to spread on a farm.
Think also when we were losing to Cambridge, Sheff Weds earlier before the rut he was too keen to take the positives and ignore the negatives. Thats why theres no panic in the players. Been coached into a mistakes dont matter mentality. Now, hes like a supply teacher who's let the class muck about for half an hour and now wants them to behave and concentrate, too late! Precedent has been set.
Maybe after 25mins in the match we could see a Santos subbed off, a Doyle replaced. Dapo or John. Send a shortwave.
Trouble is thats probably going to cause a conflict and Evatt will probably release the players to Boreham Wood becsuse his ego cant deal with it.
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Post by realtrottersforever on Dec 10, 2021 11:20:46 GMT
To be honest that Wycombe comparison/business model will be fuel for the happy clappers. They'll say Ainsworth has been given time and managed to build success on and off. I think Evatt gets caught out in hi s web of lies and delusions. So his comments get twisted and turned and make him, and us, lool amateur. And this goes back to the imitation syndrome he suffers from. For example I genuinely believe Evatt only said we didnt need another striker "ansolute nonsense" because at the same time Pep was saying the same thing having failed to land Kane. Arent they two peas from the same pod? When you have a plan and give honest answers(as he claims he always does) you rarely get caught out in contradictions. You might upset some fans with the truth and maybe the board but most fans can see it for what it is. Sarce and Politic are too examples talking enough BS to spread on a farm.
Think also when we were losing to Cambridge, Sheff Weds earlier before the rut he was too keen to take the positives and ignore the negatives. Thats why theres no panic in the players. Been coached into a mistakes dont matter mentality. Now, hes like a supply teacher who's let the class muck about for half an hour and now wants them to behave and concentrate, too late! Precedent has been set. Maybe after 25mins in the match we could see a Santos subbed off, a Doyle replaced. Dapo or John. Send a shortwave. Trouble is thats probably going to cause a conflict and Evatt will probably release the players to Boreham Wood becsuse his ego cant deal with it. haha yes. I didn't think anyone could surpass Freedman, but I think he has managed it. I never warmed to Freedman. he too had the team in the lower reaches around December in his first season, and had a "transfer spree" fuelled good run in the 2nd half. that guy made Knight captain....hmmmmm any parallels to anyone. god, much as I'm not Santos's biggest fan, I like him far more than i do Knight. at least Santos can hit good long raking passes, and pass short decently, and dribbles really well. both very poor at scoring from set pieces considering their size. my fave Evatt contradiction....is the Covid one. wanted season stopped in January..when we were still scratching for form. despite testing just been brought in, and many managers satisfied with that. yet we seal promotion, Bolton still in local lockdown with delta spike & worst figures in the country, and he lets players out from coach or stadium to hug & take selfies. & also initiated the huddle even in January time i think. Freedman also had that habit of telling everyone how honest he was....people who are, rarely keep telling people...dodgy car salesmen do it loads. as for Fraudiola, just love that Champions lge final last year. even Trev Sinclair..with his city links was on talksport today ,admitting he cocked it up. picks no orthodox striker..despite having Aguero & Jesus. his topscorer is actually gundogan..a fairly defensive midfielder who'd had a bit of a freak scoring season. he picks no orthodox defensive mid, despite having 2 options..( 63mill record signing )Rodri , & Fernandinho, but actually plays Gundogan in that role..therefore negating both his defensive stuff and scoring possibilities. he picks Sterling despite him being out of form..1 lge goal since late Feb. & in the end they have 1 SHOT ON TARGET in their 1st ever Champions lge final / Euro cup. meanwhile the opponent,Chelsea, picks a fairly orthodox striker, and and a def mid..Kante who is arguably man of the match. the previous season they went out to Lyon. always remember Alan Hansen saying, when you get knocked out, at least make sure you get knocked out by a credible opponent...someone who will probably win it, if you can't. just look at the budget differences to Lyon. it's almost a guilt trip that he's "only doing it 'cos of the money" ....so he makes weird changes that put his own stamp on it......in this case the stamp of failure. not saying he's a bad manager by any stretch, just so hard to judge when you don't work your way up from the bottom, and prove yourself & get handed mega money budgets. Klopp seems better for me, 3 champions lge finals with lower budget clubs, Dortmund and Liv... people who he signs become great, like Salah and Van dijk rather than signing the finished product.
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