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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2016 9:08:09 GMT
I agree Ooom. Refereeing standards have been excellent. Much down to Collina's oversight. Clattenburg has been excellent in all his games.quick unobtrusive decision making .Dull though it was the final flowed and much was down to his pace of thought and movement. Watched and rewatched Koscielny and Matoudi were unluckily carded but 98%excellent. As I've said before Clattenburg is in my opinion the best referee around currently. And if on here I hold a minority view on that I think that my view must be shared by the FA and UEFA Rapidly coming to the conclusion that you are on his yet to be payed list Andy .
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Post by OohMac on Jul 11, 2016 21:28:48 GMT
I agree Ooom. Refereeing standards have been excellent. Much down to Collina's oversight. Clattenburg has been excellent in all his games.quick unobtrusive decision making .Dull though it was the final flowed and much was down to his pace of thought and movement. Watched and rewatched Koscielny and Matoudi were unluckily carded but 98%excellent. As I've said before Clattenburg is in my opinion the best referee around currently. And if on here I hold a minority view on that I think that my view must be shared by the FA and UEFA He's had some good games and seems to step up to the occasion. Wasn't a tough job like Howard Webb's final but there was never a cause for complaint. Mike Riley was the FA and UEFA choice so that tells me that they don't judge refs by the standard of the "fans that pay". Oh well, I doubt we'll see much of Mr Clattenberg at the Macron anytime soon anyway.
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Post by joanna on Jul 12, 2016 9:24:06 GMT
Best to keep quiet about sharing any views of UEFA's, don't you think?!!
I'm afraid their support for a referee suggests something distinctly underhand and seedy is going on.
Certainly, the majority of fans and the media are well aware of Clattenburg's blatant failings.
Not sure that the FA's views are ideal either:-aren't they the ones who choose England managers?!!
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Post by joanna on Jul 12, 2016 11:59:38 GMT
It seemed to me that all the referees were aided by the fact that there was little of the sort of arguing and dissent that we see in our premiership.
Surrounding the ref, intimidation and physical contact were pretty non-existent thankfully. (Although Clats managed take every opportunity to find a way to touch players in his over-familiar style)
In keeping with most of the tepid, dull, uninspired play, there were few dramatic clashes or outbursts for refs to deal with.
However, diving, simulation, exaggerated rolling over in apparent agony, and pulling and pushing in the box continued unabated and unchecked by referees. Just one penalty and/or dismissal for deliberate offences of these types would immediately stop such cheating and ugliness. Referees simply need to tell players before the game that they will enforce the rules 100% and we will be treated to much more edifying displays. Do we have any officials brave enough to follow this through? Has UEFA got the guts to oversee positive changes of this sort to copy the lead set by Rugby?
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Post by andyl on Jul 13, 2016 11:13:18 GMT
Re Clattenburg I just wish we could celebrate a quite extraordinary set of matches for a fine referee. But if not it can be done elsewhere. Re the tournament's diving and cheating I thought that was less of that too. But I completely agree that whenever it occurs it's a disgrace. I think referees ignored it well at times. I'm not convinced that confrontation is the solution. Sometimes just playing on at speed works better.?
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Post by OohMac on Aug 3, 2016 21:30:40 GMT
Just to confirm what I've always thought of him, one of the biggest egos in the game and that's including players and managers and even owners, Mark Clattenberg has had two tattoos celebrating his biggest games Champions League and Euros final.
It's been an impressive year for him no doubt but it doesn't half sum him up.
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Post by joanna on Dec 5, 2017 16:14:47 GMT
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Post by andyl on Dec 12, 2017 3:39:13 GMT
What I think is that Clattenberg was an outstanding referee in a class of his own in terms of fitness and speed around the field and the clarity of his decisions for spectators. He made many games flow. He has influenced a generation. It was for example obvious that Saturday's referee at Forest had modelled aspects of his game on Clattenberg. Clattenburg rose rapidly to the pinnacle of his career the UEFA games and in that is on a level with some great referees of the past eg Jack Taylor, George Courteney, Clive Thomas ( even more outspoken and controversial ) and superior to the likes of Gallagher, Riley and Hackett. Only Collina in my lifetime has impressed more but Inever saw him live. In recentish times Paul Durkin was almost as outstanding.
Re what is quoted here a far more illustrious example of a referee trying not to send players off was Howard Webb's handling of the World cup final between Spain and Holland. He was determined not to create an imbalance and allowed some terrible fouls to pass with yellow cards. He had a very clear game plan. There are contradictions in Gallagher's views and Ian Wright is hardly an expert pundit. But I have no doubt that Clattenberg was consistent. Throughout his career he let challenges that others would penalise pass and the game was the better for many of those decisions - a very early example being a brilliant Luton v Liverpool cup match. Clattenberg's last appearance at a Bolton home game was the Eastleigh return and he gave a master class performance.
All of that said Clattenberg did court controversy through his career and whatever he has said here is at best unclear. I have never thought him an especially good person ( with the obvious point that I've never met him- but he has always had the capacity to irritate) At worst he has opened himself to the same criticisms as Webb. Re the game Iwrote fully at the time. Nothing changes my view of that.
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Post by joanna on Dec 12, 2017 16:32:23 GMT
I agree with much of what you write, Andy, BUT:-
often gets/got the BIG decisions wrong;
involved in some seedy goings-on;
far too "friendly" with star players;
far too keen to be the centre of attention;
going into matches with a game-plan is just wrong. Rules have to be applied at all times:- it is not for him to pick and choose. Backing from UEFA is hardly something to be proud of!
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Post by wots on Dec 24, 2017 17:12:51 GMT
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