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Post by OohMac on Jan 31, 2015 17:10:02 GMT
That last minute has put the playoff dream to bed I would think. One point this week when we should have been looking for 4 or 6 and another injury to Pratley. Odd that he put Moxey on instead of the new lad, Hall or even Eidur
Suppose he knows Gudjonson has to play 90mins on Wednesday with no ALF, Davies or Heskey and now Pratley. When you add Clayton, Lee and Mark Davies to that it shows how dilapidated we are. We now have two days to bring in two side men, two attacking midfielders and a couple of strikers.
Are we paying the price of not rotating the squad? Has to be more than plain bad luck. Hated the tinkering especially taking in form players out but we could do an injured 11 vs a fit 11 match there's so many(would hope that the fit 11 would win at a canter)
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Post by socalwanderers on Jan 31, 2015 17:17:21 GMT
That last minute has put the playoff dream to bed I would think. One point this week when we should have been looking for 4 or 6 and another injury to Pratley. Odd that he put Moxey on instead of the new lad, Hall or even Eidur Suppose he knows Gudjonson has to play 90mins on Wednesday with no ALF, Davies or Heskey and now Pratley. When you add Clayton, Lee and Mark Davies to that it shows how dilapidated we are. We now have two days to bring in two side men, two attacking midfielders and a couple of strikers. Are we paying the price of not rotating the squad? Has to be more than plain bad luck. Hated the tinkering especially taking in form players out but we could do an injured 11 vs a fit 11 match there's so many(would hope that the fit 11 would win at a canter) I think this game wasn't the tactics Mac.. Just pure luck on Wolves part... I believe a 25 yard shot to be the only one they had on target all game!! No one to blame on this to be fair just unlucky today
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2015 17:23:17 GMT
Football is so painful for us Bolton fans why can't we bang one in from 30 yards out or is it just that we don't get the luck ? . I think that's it for now just make sure we stay up and keep hold of NL. Sorry for my rant five minutes ago but we was above forest till that goal went in
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Post by socalwanderers on Jan 31, 2015 17:39:49 GMT
Football is so painful for us Bolton fans why can't we bang one in from 30 yards out or is it just that we don't get the luck ? . I think that's it for now just make sure we stay up and keep hold of NL. Sorry for my rant five minutes ago but we was above forest till that goal went in Lol my wife's boss is a big forest fan!! The start of the season he was always banging on about winning promotion etc.. My how things have changed!! Lol level on points just goal difference seperates us now!! Just remember in NL we have someone that can take us places!! not this season but we can all live in hope!!
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Post by andyl on Jan 31, 2015 18:10:12 GMT
Frustrating though the last minute screamer was over the whole game we had two moments of Zach Clough to thank for it not being, as it would have been earlier in the season a dismal home defeat. In truth we didn't play very well and they had the initiative most of the time without creating very much. We did defend well and especially when Moxey came on we shored up the left hand side very well. Pratley as ever had been our most energetic midfielder but defensively we didn't miss him.
Of course we started as sluggishly as at Rotherham. Dervite and Lonergan repeated their dithering inertia from Tuesday and conceded a goal in its way very similar to Rotherham's second . Dervite trod water, Lonergan hesitated and then failed to stand tall and Dick, I think snuck through to rifle a gift goal. He had also done something similar when he beat Lonergan to the punch at Molineux. Lonergan will be pleased to see the last of Wolves. He may well not have started this game after his midweek showing had Bogdan stayed fit. I doubt he could have done much with the equaliser though. His distribution was at times quite terrible.
In midfield Trotter did well I thought until fading late on. Danns was too inclined to turn into trouble or let balls run past him for comfort today and both he and Pratley had difficulty moving the ball forward. Feeney made a few crosses and busied himself to no particular advantage. Le Fondre held the ball up well and had a promising debut possibly being fouled away from his best chance late in the first half
Clough's two goals were brilliant. A perfect free kick followed by a neat turn and shot in the box. What a prospect he is. He oozes intelligence on the ball. He perhaps lacked a little defensively and was sensibly subbed. I think his partnership with Le Fondre showed lots of promise. Otherwise Vela was the standout player. Even when beaten his recovery play was excellent and he is so much better going forward than most of his colleagues in midfield or defence
at the death I think we had a chance to close the game out in the corner. But generally in the last thirty other than on the left we just didn't keep the ball well enough and fell too deep out of possession. It was probably a fair result for a neutral but ultimately a disappointing one for us and leaves us hovering only just above the dogfight with a negligible play off chance. But if we keep NL and our injured players return we should finish strongly. At present we are hanging on
Lonergan 5 Vela 7 Wheater 7 Dervite 3 Ream 7 Pratley 5 Danns 5 Trotter 6 Feeney 6 Le Fondre 7 Clough 9 Moxey 7
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Post by OohMac on Jan 31, 2015 18:12:00 GMT
With Stuart Pearce in charge them days will come again.
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Post by davidm on Jan 31, 2015 19:27:27 GMT
What a sickener to concede so late.
Looking at the match overall, despite Wolves’ possession in the second half, Lonergan had nothing to do apart from pick the ball out of the net twice.
We set off poorly. Ream slipped in the first minute (one of many slips) and they were clear on the right. Thanks to Wheater we got out of that problem but then Dervite just went to sleep and let a ball go over him and Dicko got goalside to run on and score. A really poor goal to concede. Just 3 minutes gone and we were struggling.
We could not get going in those early minutes but credit to the team we eventually got into the game and dominated the remaining 30 minutes of the first half.
Pratley won a fortuitous free kick when he seemed to have pushed the ball too far and also was already on the way down when he was tackled. Zac Clough put a wonderful free kick into the far corner of the net. A real quality goal. He then repeated the trick when Ream got clear on the left and pulled the ball back for Clough to make space and again score well.
At half time, we were deservedly ahead.
Second half, though, we just could not get going. Wolves had most of the ball but were no danger but we needed to control the ball instead of some of the aimless clearances that we were doing.
Le Fondre made a chance with a fine turn and shot which the Wolves goalie saved well but chances were few and far between, as were Wolves’ chances.
We seemed to have won the points despite some frantic defending but Dervite and Danns made a hash of a challenge leaving Henry clear 25 yards out to rocket the ball in.
Absolute sickening but it does highlight a lack of control in team.
Lonergan - 6 Absolutely nothing to do. Despite Wolves having a load of possession, I can’t think of anything on target other than the 2 goals which he had no chance with.
Vela - 6 Got caught a few times but still looks a class act.
Wheater - 8 Won practically everything, highlighted by a crunching tackle in the first couple of minutes.
Dervite - 4 Sleepy. Caught out for the first goal, partly to blame for the equaliser and loads of poor passes and slips throughout the game.
Ream - 5 Started in the first minute with a slip which Wheater rescued him from and many slips and missed tackles throughout. Untypical of him. I know it’s not wholly his fault but our throw-ins are pathetic and we give the ball away 90% of the time.
Danns - 6 Steady but caught, along with Dervite for the equaliser. Tries too many pirouette turns and gets caught in a lot of them.
Pratley - 6 Hard work – nothing spectacular. Unfortunate injury. How many players are we going to miss through injury?
Trotter - 7 Steady and some decent passes but his place is mainly too deep for my liking.
Clough - 9 Excellent again. Amazing goals. Ran out of breath in the end which is not surprising. Two games and two star performances.
Feeney - 5 Final ball is still not good enough for me. He and Hall need shooting for messing up possession in the last minute.
Le Fondre - 7 A very promising performance. He looked dangerous throughout. I have high hopes that he will score a few goals for us.
Hall - 5 A few good touches but he and Feeney made a complete mess of possession at the corner flag in the 94th minute.
Moxey - 6 Much better than the start of the season. Only complaint is that towards the last few minutes he insisted of quickly passing the ball upfield when a bit of care and caution could have seen us through. Manager - 7 It’s a hard job at the minute getting a side together with so many injuries. He somehow needed to get the side to keep possession in the second half when we just continually lost it.
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Post by riochforthereebok on Feb 1, 2015 12:47:01 GMT
That last minute has put the playoff dream to bed I would think. One point this week when we should have been looking for 4 or 6 and another injury to Pratley. Odd that he put Moxey on instead of the new lad, Hall or even Eidur Suppose he knows Gudjonson has to play 90mins on Wednesday with no ALF, Davies or Heskey and now Pratley. When you add Clayton, Lee and Mark Davies to that it shows how dilapidated we are. We now have two days to bring in two side men, two attacking midfielders and a couple of strikers. Are we paying the price of not rotating the squad? Has to be more than plain bad luck. Hated the tinkering especially taking in form players out but we could do an injured 11 vs a fit 11 match there's so many(would hope that the fit 11 would win at a canter) I think this game wasn't the tactics Mac.. Just pure luck on Wolves part... I believe a 25 yard shot to be the only one they had on target all game!! No one to blame on this to be fair just unlucky today Disagree.... Quote Brian Clough "Show me a great goal and I'll show you a bad mistake" They were at us all afternoon and we allowed them to lay on too much pressure in the last 10 minutes, but there were 11 'professionals' out there for us and 1 corner flag either side of the Wolves goal, did they not think to run down the clock? Or at least raise the pressure on them for the last 10 minutes and make sure Karl Henry wasn't allowed to smack a 35 yarder in on the very very last second of the game!!! It's now looking like the season is well and truly over on Wednesday should we get beat off the scousers as this is really the only thing left to go at. Mind you, I suppose this is the best time for NL to do his tinkering and dealing Still think NL is a genius
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2015 14:52:52 GMT
Just seen the goal on you tube and what I can't work out is why did nobody get in front of him?. Great strike so it was but when you get the room to hit it what do you expect. I just hope we don't fall away now and just end up staying up. Question for everybody how long has NL signed a contract for and will he stay if he gets no help with getting players in?. Now on to Wednesday and Liverpool let's hope for a great game and maybe you never know.
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Post by OohMac on Feb 1, 2015 18:45:01 GMT
With Stuart Pearce in charge them days will come again. Dam hes left. Forest could be playoff hopefuls yet. Awful manager.
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Post by kcobain4 on Feb 1, 2015 20:48:12 GMT
With Stuart Pearce in charge them days will come again. Dam hes left. Forest could be playoff hopefuls yet. Awful manager. Dougie has replaced him! Good luck to them...
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Post by andyl on Feb 2, 2015 16:36:33 GMT
A couple of days on. I 've read other posts and a few articles on the game and also watched NL's immediate post match reaction and exchanged a text or two with friends.A few points
1. Dervite had a shocker. Slow to move on the first and yet again failure to go firmly at an aerial header cost us a game. It's a terrible weakness of his and Mills game. Wheater in contrast goes up for everything. Even if slow he's better than the other two as a centre half and by a distance at championship level, Against Liverpool forwards may be too quick for him
2. Why does Ream keep falling over? He was so much better v Liverpool. Just hope he will be again
3. Lonergan put a further argument in the Lonergan v Bogdan debate. He was awful on the first goal, neither coming out when he should nor standing tall and protecting the near post. His movement in effect vacated the space for a straight shot and if Dervite and others before dropped him in the mire he was flimsy. More controversially perhaps but I'm pretty sure NL agrees he wasn't good on the equaliser. A great shot but he was too far out and dived too low. It would have been a very good effort had he made the save but it was saveable. Bogdan managed to claw a very similar possibly even harder shot on to a post at Brighton a couple of years ago. The debate is academic because of Bogdan's injury but we will miss Bogdan v Liverpool. Bogdan can appear more imposing. Lonergan makes great saves but when the ball is inthe air I know my dominant feeling is of relief rather than expectation when he gets something on it and the goal looks somehow bigger when he's in it.
4. Clough is a real find. Can otehrs follow. We need it because Danns and Pratley ( notwithstanding injury) are fading
5. Why are we getting all these injuries? Bad luck, weather or too much pressing or too little rotation possible within a threadbare squad. The debate is the polar opposite of that which we had with Freedman.
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Post by realtrottersforever on Feb 2, 2015 17:04:02 GMT
What I want to know is, was there any need to water the pitch on Saturday before the game? My garden in Blackrod was saturated on Saturday morning, and although the pitch has far better drainage, I can't for one minute think it actually needed watering following the amount of rain that came down over Friday night.
As for injuries, why is it the more influential players that are getting injured. Could it be they are putting in more effort than the others? eg. Pratley v Trotter. As for Pratley fading, I think he has been getting better and better with each match barring a bit of an off day against Rotherham. We were a poorer side once he had gone off on Saturday.
What exactly does Trotter and for that matter Feeney bring to the table? Both's theme tune could be "Busy doing nothing"........
We're busy doin' nothin' Workin' the whole day through Tryin' to find lots of things not to do We're busy goin' nowhere Isn't it just a crime We'd like to be unhappy, but We never do have the time
Trotter is a defensive midfielder who never tackles anyone and couldn't catch a cold even if he tried and Feeney is a winger who won't take anyone on and hardly ever gets a decent cross in. They are two of our weakest links.
Dervite had a very poor game, he was at fault in part for both goals, and for someone who Marc Iles said (when he signed) was comfortable on the ball, his passing stats are awful at 61.4% for the game, the worst in the team apart from Lonergan That in comparison to Clough who had a 90.9% success rate.
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Post by joanna on Feb 2, 2015 17:31:56 GMT
Davidm wrote:" Lonergan ..... the 2 goals which he had no chance with."
Andy L, however, claims Lonergan could have saved both goals! If he really thinks AL could have saved the second goal, then he goes against all opinion. Not even the greatest goalkeeper the world has ever seen would have stopped that thunderbolt. He often used to make similar claims about JJ when our superstar had absolutely no chance of saving. Andy, you were wrong then and you are wrong now. You resort to going back over two years (!!) to find a Bogdan save to compare. Ludicrous! Bogdan is your favourite, based on one game this season whereas Lonners had a whole string of MOM performances.
Andy is similarly biased when it comes to Trotter in whom he sees qualities that no one else credits him with, and he also maintained that DF had several virtues. He didn't!! (as Forest are about to discover!)
This constant desire to find fault with some star players and to heap praise on those who don't deserve it is very irritating. I notice you have done a complete about-turn in your opinion of Danns who you once said was hopeless. Was that judgement based on a single game too? What are you trying to prove? That your judgement is superior, in that you can detect things that we ordinary mortals can't?
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Post by andyl on Feb 2, 2015 23:41:39 GMT
In general , Joanna, I try to look at how players perform on specific occasions and allow for change be it improvement or deterioration. Danns has been a revelation under NL brilliant v Liverpool but has had two average games since. Bogdan had a very average half season last year but was good at the end and has played two excellent games this. Lonergan was twice at fault on goal two at Rotherham and all over the place on goal one v Wolves. Re goal two v Wolves it was 35 yards out and rose through Lonergan stretching to his right. It was a fabulous shot and close to unstoppable. Lonergan was surprised and easily beaten on this occasion. His positioning could be criticised and NL pretty much criticised it in his interview.I thought the same about Bogdan ' s miracle save at Brighton and a handful of others seen over a much longer period from lots of our keeper's. Yet somehow on these occasions they got to the near impossible. My opinion is that Bogdan at best is better than Lonergan. It is a matter of opinion. Some will share yours some mine.
Trotter was more than reasonable at Rotherham. NL accordingly picked him v Wolves. He did as well as any on the day without being good. I quite accept that he will find it hard to win fans over because of his lethargic demeanour. I am not a fan as such but I do like some of what he does- the pass for Clough v Wigan for example. At other times he has caused goals against - but nothing like the number Spearing had a hand in...
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