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Post by davidm on Apr 16, 2016 15:31:17 GMT
Bit of a disagreement from me compared to others.
I thought that we were desperately weak.
There were so many occasions when we won the ball and immediately gave it away.
We have a very shaky defence, a toothless attack but our midfield is the root cause of our problems. They cannot help the defence. They just let the opposition have the ball and filter backwards and there is very little from the midfield in an attacking sense.
We are so weak that even when Vela scored, there was little or no hope from me and my family that we would finish up winning and when the 5 minutes overtime went up, it seemed inevitable that we would concede. We are so weak throughout the side.
I don’t understand Jimmy Phillips’ teams. Heskey? He may well be our best no 9 but he won’t be here next season (will he?) so what’s the point. Then bringing on Trotter to play up front. Someone please explain.
Amos - 5 Not sure if he could be blamed for either goal. His distribution though was awful. Poor kicking all match.
Maher - 6 Quite impressed today. He had a few mis-kicks but steady.
Wheater - 6 Beaten for headers at Boro’s first 2 corners and we could have easily conceded on both occasions. Improved after that but who was marking Rhodes for the winner
Holding - 5 Same comment re marking for the winner.
Moxey - 2 Terrible throughout. Boro’s winner came from Nugent breaking into acres of space behind Moxey who then couldn’t stop the cross.
Vela - 5 Too many misplaced passes today. Took his goal well.
Derik - 5 I wasn’t as impressed as others by him. His passing/heading was random with most going to the opposition.
Pratley - 2 Why is he undroppable? First half, he was just the proverbial headless chicken. Second half he got more involved and actually tackled OK but his passing was dreadful. Please please get rid of him.
Davies - 4 A few good runs but too many negative passes which got us into trouble a few times.
Heskey - 2 I don’t see the point. He didn’t win many balls and couldn’t hold the ball up. Another I want to see the end of.
Clough - 5 A scintillating run in the first half and a few other decent touches. But he doesn’t look like scoring.
Trotter - 3 Don’t understand playing him up front.
Woolery - 2 One on one with Ayalla in the second half but didn’t have the confidence.
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Post by spanishjonny on Apr 16, 2016 16:44:21 GMT
As bad as Heskey is, if he could have lasted 90 mins I think we would have won today We need a big strong mobile bruiser upfront, someone who can win headers and hold up play, Trotter has none of these qualities, it looked like Reid's idea to stick the gentle giant upfront and that was our down fall today, when Mavies burst into the box late on looking for a one-two Trotter ran away JP should have moved Derik up front and put Danns or Trotter in Deriks place, we have no one else, looks like Madine is in the sin bin Was expecting a 4+ hammering so pleased with the performance overall
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2016 17:24:28 GMT
I Wonder what our points tally would be if we did not keep conceding late goals were we have lost 3 points or 1 still another Saturday of sorrow might as well go and get pissed but I might go down to Cardiff should be fun.
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Post by joanna on Apr 16, 2016 18:39:05 GMT
The general performance today showed that many of the squad can contribute positively next season. I certainly don't agree with those on here who say that there is no effort. The enthusiasm and spirit are remarkably high for a team that has endured so much both on and off the field.
On the other hand, Phillips' team selection is revealing a small number of players who are simply not up to the job in terms of ability. Form is temporary; class is permanent. It's up to the coaching staff and manager to consistently get the best out of those with class; the others can be jettisoned as hopeless cases. A more positive role for Pratley's energy needs to be found.
There are signs that JP is getting some organisation into the ranks and they are certainly responding with enthusiasm but chaotic defending, especially in the last few minutes, remains an achilles heel. This is where an expert in sports psychology would be valuable to assist JP and a new manager who knows worthwhile recruits when he sees them and is used to finding the methods that succeed in the lower divisions.
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Post by davidm on Apr 16, 2016 20:20:31 GMT
Moxey - 2 Terrible throughout. Boro’s winner came from Nugent breaking into acres of space behind Moxey who then couldn’t stop the cross.
Apologies to Moxey - just seen the goals. It was Pratley who stood and watched Nugent break into the box. Just fast asleep
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Post by bonaparte on Apr 17, 2016 9:16:42 GMT
I agree with Joanna, there are green shoots, I hope they continue to develop. No player for me stood out as either good or bad, all just mediocre or lacking in confidence. Tuesday's match will give a good indicator. Will the players play as they did yesterday with some commitment, or was that just for the TV audience? Will JP stick with the same eleven, and give some stability? Can they concentrate for 95 minutes, especially in defence.
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Post by whitesince63 on Apr 17, 2016 11:15:16 GMT
I agree with Joanna, there are green shoots, I hope they continue to develop. No player for me stood out as either good or bad, all just mediocre or lacking in confidence. Tuesday's match will give a good indicator. Will the players play as they did yesterday with some commitment, or was that just for the TV audience? Will JP stick with the same eleven, and give some stability? Can they concentrate for 95 minutes, especially in defence. I don't really see it as a confidence thing boney, it's just rank bad defending. There is just no consistent organisation with even basics ignored. Take the second yesterday, Moxey (as usual) was in no mans land and Pratley was completely the wrong side of his man allowing him time and space to cross for the also unmarked Rhodes. We see this week in week out so why is it not addressed. I just don't accept the players aren't good enough. We have a competent squad who should be doing much better but it's the basics letting them down every time. If BSA was managing this team I guarantee we wouldn't be losing goals like that. People criticise Amos for not saving 25 yarders, OK, but what about players stopping them getting the shot in first. The whole set up is wrong and whoever comes in as manager needs to know how to organise the defence before anything else. That defence starts from centre forward. How many headed clearances, blocks and tackles did SKD make? We need that from everyone on the pitch as soon as we lose the ball but most especially with the defenders getting behind their men and stopping moves happening in the first place. Surely this isn't bloody rocket science so why have we got into this mess?
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Post by joanna on Apr 17, 2016 12:20:31 GMT
Yep, SKD was special. Remember those trademark crunching tackles in the first seconds of each match to put the fear of God into defenders that dawdle on the ball? In any sport, attempts to dominate the opposition are vital.....and I think the initial pressing and harrying tactic is abandoned when we try to hold on and go on the defensive. As we tire, our defenders lose concentration, get on the wrong side and lack the speed and strength to rectify situations. Fitness, both physical and mental, seem to me to be lacking and you're right, WS63:- more needs to be done to coach positional sense if our players lack pace....which they do! But psychological boosting of confidence and concentration could also be a target for a mental trainer, to improve capability in the latter stages of matches.
As for putting Trotter up front yesterday, I can see why JP would try that. (Maybe they have been practising that idea in training). He's a big, immovable lump and Andy L is always telling us how good he is at heading the ball, so worth a try on a like-for-like basis with Emile who had some success before his substitution. In any case, fans moan when managers don't experiment....and then moan when they do! Clearly Clough benefits when he has strength and physique alongside him to hold the ball up and lay it off. Trotter ought to be able to do that much. He does score the odd goal too, so worth a go, especially as he is so laboured in his usual midfield position. The alternative, Madine, is evidently on the naughty step and sets no sort of example to the others. Those who don't look as if they are exerting themselves should be released so they don't transmit a similar lethargy to their peers, which can cause resentment in those like Pratley who are busting a gut.
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Post by whitesince63 on Apr 17, 2016 13:03:07 GMT
Quite agree Joanna, mental strength is vital if we are to succeed but surely getting that into players should be a function of either the coaching staff or strong minded players such as Nolan might be if brought in as a player or player coach. We lack an on field leader and have done for years. Look at any successful side over the years and they have strong players on the field who boss the others. Look at the great Arsenal, Leeds, Liverpool and Man U sides of the past and they had them in spades which is why they were successful. I don't say a mental trainer wouldn't be useful but without the strong minded players first it would probably be less effective. Even looking back on our own successful teams we've had the likes of Nobby, Campo, Hierro and Speed to name a few so we really need to find players with good mental strength already, in place of the lacklustre wimps we've got now.
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Post by OohMac on Apr 17, 2016 13:22:38 GMT
Think Jimmy thought what's the point in playing youth and getting turned over if I'm not being considered for next year. Sure if he was still in with a chance next year he would have dropped Heskey and Davies again.
The performance was a typical Lennon team. Combative but lacking. Unless Heskey and Davies are agreeing to take 80% wage cuts we should really be trying new faces.
Played best 2 teams in the league and Brighton and been in the games until late on. There's no way we should only have 4 wins under our belt. Pathetic and weak, mentally and physically
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Post by thegrud1 on Apr 17, 2016 16:46:24 GMT
The problem with playing Heskey is that he cant chase down defenders(defending from the front), several times on Saturday a midfielder did the closing down(usually Vela or Pratley). Which meant when the ball was moved forward one of them was out of postion(a body short in midfield)....its too easy for our oppenents midfield to play the ball when we are short in midfield, and usually Vela or Prately get harangued for being out of position! Maybe if Heskey plays we should just drop off and keep our shape!
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Post by bonaparte on Apr 17, 2016 19:07:39 GMT
OK Whites, I agree the centre forward should be part of the defence, and I think Heskey did his bit. But the start of the defence is the keeper and the two centre backs. These should be the first names on the sheet, and should be regulars, providing they perform. Holding and Wheater seem to be the current ones, with Amos behind. Their understanding is crucial. The keeper has the best view of things, and to my mind Amos does not take charge often enough, I recall Hopkinson (showing my age) not the biggest keeper in the world, but boy did he give out to his defenders, all big tough lads. Come on JP keep the same back three, and come on Amos take control ( and also practice your kicking).
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